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How RNG works?


psrquack

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The first part of your original post started well as it is true that an alogithm cannot be truly random, however, the rest of your post was just complete nonsense.  Many people have run up large wins from small amounts in roulette, it's not uncommon.  Either you're a genius that can predict the RNG in which case you're an idiot for not exploiting that on every casino you can for hundreds of thousands of pounds or you had a lucky streak, followed by an unlucky one in which you lost most of it back.  I know which one my money is on.

I would love to hear how you beat the algorithm because any time I've been into a bookies and someone starts talking about their theories on the FOBT machines they come across as completely deluded.

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@Eeezee 

    Take no notice of these poor deluded fools, I totally believe your inspiring story as I too have cracked the rng code. However I should point out that you made a mistake in pressing too hard for profits, it was too easy for the Unibet hierarchy to flag you as a winner and resort to changing the algorithms in an effort to halt your impressive upward trajectory. I prefer to win a little and often so as not to cause any concerns to the powers that be, so much so that I had to stop yesterday after only two spins when I realised something just didn't add up.

1172478846_Screenshot(3053).png.30ae9c940f25ca9e6e209001c5c47691.png

Losing a pound was heartbreaking, Unibet must be on to me, so it was off to bed and some deep thinking. After a good night's sleep and a hearty breakfast I came back stronger than ever, and with some furious mental gymnastics and wearing out four pencils I cracked the code yet again.

384519434_Screenshot(3054).png.48b7b90fcc7723c471a68e69a09e29a0.png 

This could be a long and arduous game of cat and mouse with Unibet, I really wish I could pick your brains in the ongoing battle of wits, but now you have stopped playing roulette I'll have to soldier on by myself. Anyhow, cracking the poker code is sure to keep you busy, sadly something I'm not quite up to yet, so best of luck in your endeavours.

      Yours GR1ZZL3R. :Smile:

 

P:S  If you get your Aces cracked twice in a row, beware, they're probably onto you and you may have to consider folding every so often.:Teardrop:

 

 

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"It turns out that 75% of all poker players think they play better than the other 75%."     image.png.99a4e82708d54abfc527324e8836768e.png

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@Eeezee wrote:

My explanation of why rng is not truly random? My explanation is accurate. Go do some research, Google it, or ask Unibet themselves. How did you think random numbers were generated?


@Eeezee so you saw the code 'rng' and you think the current Unibet employees have also seen it ..

1. Did you see the functions used in it?  

2.  Are you aware that another company is dealing with poker or casino software?   So why are you writing here about Unibet employees?

3.Are you aware that a lot of people have access to rng (also programmers without editing options)? do you think Relax is a 3-person garage company? You have to be the last moron to create a weak tool that can easily be beaten (or create some backdoors to control the game) and expose you to fines and loss of reputation - especially when you have dozens of potential leaks. 

We're also talking about Relax, who delivers its products to other casinos.

ps. as @Brocky said, no one without white mice before his eyes would brag in public that they found a pattern in any rng🤣

 

 

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"Small opportunities are often the beginning of great enterprises."
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@Brocky wrote:

The first part of your original post started well as it is true that an alogithm cannot be truly random, however, the rest of your post was just complete nonsense.  Many people have run up large wins from small amounts in roulette, it's not uncommon.  Either you're a genius that can predict the RNG in which case you're an idiot for not exploiting that on every casino you can for hundreds of thousands of pounds or you had a lucky streak, followed by an unlucky one in which you lost most of it back.  I know which one my money is on.

I would love to hear how you beat the algorithm because any time I've been into a bookies and someone starts talking about their theories on the FOBT machines they come across as completely deluded.


Lol!

I really don't know where to start . . .

Firstly, I am not a genius who can predict rng and I don't claim to be. I actually agree with you that it could just have been a lucky winning streak though, as I have said, this is unlikely. The reason is simple, my wins were based on variable strings of numbers that I figured out the algorithm would favour if I bet in a certain way at certain times. Coincidence? Those in the know can easily check my betting patterns and see this is what I was doing. Those strings, however, changed after a couple of days and new more complex strings began to emerge. These were still somewhat predictable but reduced my strike rate significantly.

Secondly, not all rngs are created equal. The 'randomness' of any rng software is based on the quality of the programming and this can be specifically formulated to achieve certain results. A lot of online casinos, for example, deliberately soften the rng of their freeplay games in order to entice more people into depositing and playing real money games.

Thirdly, I do not believe that I, or anyone else, can work out the algorithm consistently enough to reverse the house's edge.

It was a winning streak of sorts, not the kind where I got lucky and picked a few random numbers to press but the kind where, for a short while I was able to latch on to entire strings of numbers that I knew would appear with a short amount of spins. If I could do that regularly, I would. Unfortunately, I do not believe it is possible.

I am actually a poker player and I'm going to start a new bankroll challenge, which I'll be blogging about over in the blogs threads. Please feel free to come join me over there but I won't be making any more posts on this subject. I've made my point.

Good luck all.

 

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@Eeezee wrote:


@Brocky wrote:

The first part of your original post started well as it is true that an alogithm cannot be truly random, however, the rest of your post was just complete nonsense.  Many people have run up large wins from small amounts in roulette, it's not uncommon.  Either you're a genius that can predict the RNG in which case you're an idiot for not exploiting that on every casino you can for hundreds of thousands of pounds or you had a lucky streak, followed by an unlucky one in which you lost most of it back.  I know which one my money is on.

I would love to hear how you beat the algorithm because any time I've been into a bookies and someone starts talking about their theories on the FOBT machines they come across as completely deluded.


The reason is simple, my wins were based on variable strings of numbers that I figured out the algorithm would favour if I bet in a certain way at certain times. 

It was a winning streak of sorts, not the kind where I got lucky and picked a few random numbers to press but the kind where, for a short while I was able to latch on to entire strings of numbers that I knew would appear with a short amount of spins. 

 

 


A lot of words with nothing tangible.  I'd like to see one piece of evidence that proves it can be predicted it any way.

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I sort of get what you're trying to say @Argevolen but that wasn't predicting anything, that was working out after the fact what had been randomly generated. After a message was sent the codebreakers could work on it and decode it, then decoding all that day's messages until the "algorithm" was changed. They could not in any way predict what the next message was going to be.

"It turns out that 75% of all poker players think they play better than the other 75%."     image.png.99a4e82708d54abfc527324e8836768e.png

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@Stubbe-Unibet wrote:

There's nothing more to share than what was shared in 2015 :)

"Our exact RNG is an implementation detail that we do not wish to share, but it is a cryptographically secure pseudo random number generator that passes the statistical tests in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TestU01 . The RNG has also been verified by an outside company; eCogra ( https://www.ecogra.org), one of the largest and most recognized independent audit firm in the igaming industry, which continuously audits the software and RNG

In poker, entire deck is shuffled once before the hand starts, using a simple algorithm (Knuth Shuffle, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fisher%E2%80%93Yates_shuffle ), that produces an unbiased shuffle, given that the RNG it relies on is unbiased."

 


https://www.random.org/randomness/

These characteristics make PRNGs suitable for applications where many numbers are required and where it is useful that the same sequence can be replayed easily. Popular examples of such applications are simulation and modeling applications. PRNGs are not suitable for applications where it is important that the numbers are really unpredictable, such as data encryption and gambling.

 

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@pinki wrote:


@Eeezee wrote:

My explanation of why rng is not truly random? My explanation is accurate. Go do some research, Google it, or ask Unibet themselves. How did you think random numbers were generated?


@Eeezee so you saw the code 'rng' and you think the current Unibet employees have also seen it ..

1. Did you see the functions used in it?  

2.  Are you aware that another company is dealing with poker or casino software?   So why are you writing here about Unibet employees?

3.Are you aware that a lot of people have access to rng (also programmers without editing options)? do you think Relax is a 3-person garage company? You have to be the last moron to create a weak tool that can easily be beaten (or create some backdoors to control the game) and expose you to fines and loss of reputation - especially when you have dozens of potential leaks. 

We're also talking about Relax, who delivers its products to other casinos.

ps. as @Brocky said, no one without white mice before his eyes would brag in public that they found a pattern in any rng🤣

 

 


@pinki

Please give us 5 potential leaks, which makes impossible for Unibet(for example)to use braekeven bots and fishprotection..

I dont want to argue, this is an honest question regarding those leaks, THX!

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@GR1ZZL3R wrote:

I sort of get what you're trying to say @Argevolen but that wasn't predicting anything, that was working out after the fact what had been randomly generated. After a message was sent the codebreakers could work on it and decode it, then decoding all that day's messages until the "algorithm" was changed. They could not in any way predict what the next message was going to be.


Encryption and PRNG work on the same principle. If you are interested, read the article.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudorandom_number_generator

 

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@fish8one wrote:



https://www.random.org/randomness/

These characteristics make PRNGs suitable for applications where many numbers are required and where it is useful that the same sequence can be replayed easily. Popular examples of such applications are simulation and modeling applications. PRNGs are not suitable for applications where it is important that the numbers are really unpredictable, such as data encryption and gambling.

__________________________________________________

Along with the existing need to generate easily reproducible sequences of random numbers, there is also the need to generate completely unpredictable or simply completely random numbers. Such generators are called random number generators (RNG). Since such generators are most often used to generate unique symmetric and asymmetric encryption keys, they are most often built from a combination of crypto-resistant PRNG and an external source of entropy (and it is this combination that is now commonly understood as a RNG).

Almost all major microchip manufacturers supply hardware-based PRNGs with different entropy sources, using a variety of methods to cleanse them from inevitable predictability. However, at the moment the speed of random number collection by all existing microchips (several thousand bits per second) does not correspond to the speed of modern processors.

In modern research attempts are made to use the measurement of physical properties of objects (e.g. temperature) or even quantum fluctuations of vacuum as a source of entropy for RNG.

In personal computers, the authors of software RNG use much faster sources of entropy, such as the sound card noise or processor clock counter. Gathering entropy was the most vulnerable point of the RNG. This problem has not yet been fully solved in many devices (e.g. smart cards), which thus remain vulnerable. Many RNG use traditional tried and tested, though slow, methods of entropy collection, such as measuring user response (mouse movement, etc.), such as in PGP and Yarrow, or interactions between threads, such as in Java SecureRandom.

 


 

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All major poker rooms use entropy sources in their RNGs. In the 21st century this is the basis for the safety and quality of number generation. It also significantly reduces the ability of the poker room to falsify the game.

Which entropy source uses relax gaming in the RNG for poker?

Something tells me that this source of entropy is called "random is random."😏

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@Eeezee @You are completely delusional my friend, what you did was get extremely lucky and attach your own gamblers fallacy to it. I dare you to do it again just once and provide some proof, for that matter even a small amount of proof that you did it the first time. 

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@fish8one wrote:


@pinki wrote:


@Eeezee wrote:

My explanation of why rng is not truly random? My explanation is accurate. Go do some research, Google it, or ask Unibet themselves. How did you think random numbers were generated?


@Eeezee so you saw the code 'rng' and you think the current Unibet employees have also seen it ..

1. Did you see the functions used in it?  

2.  Are you aware that another company is dealing with poker or casino software?   So why are you writing here about Unibet employees?

3.Are you aware that a lot of people have access to rng (also programmers without editing options)? do you think Relax is a 3-person garage company? You have to be the last moron to create a weak tool that can easily be beaten (or create some backdoors to control the game) and expose you to fines and loss of reputation - especially when you have dozens of potential leaks. 

We're also talking about Relax, who delivers its products to other casinos.

ps. as @Brocky said, no one without white mice before his eyes would brag in public that they found a pattern in any rng🤣

 

 


@pinki

Please give us 5 potential leaks, which makes impossible for Unibet(for example)to use braekeven bots and fishprotection..

I dont want to argue, this is an honest question regarding those leaks, THX!


@pinki 

Edit.:

"Are you aware that a lot of people have access to rng (also programmers without editing options)?"

Also could You be more specific plz, what u meant with this sentence, and how You beacame "aware" of this info..?

Still, dont want argue, honest questions..

Thx!

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 6 months later...

@fish8one wrote:


@pinki wrote:


@Eeezee wrote:

My explanation of why rng is not truly random? My explanation is accurate. Go do some research, Google it, or ask Unibet themselves. How did you think random numbers were generated?


@Eeezee so you saw the code 'rng' and you think the current Unibet employees have also seen it ..

1. Did you see the functions used in it?  

2.  Are you aware that another company is dealing with poker or casino software?   So why are you writing here about Unibet employees?

3.Are you aware that a lot of people have access to rng (also programmers without editing options)? do you think Relax is a 3-person garage company? You have to be the last moron to create a weak tool that can easily be beaten (or create some backdoors to control the game) and expose you to fines and loss of reputation - especially when you have dozens of potential leaks. 

We're also talking about Relax, who delivers its products to other casinos.

ps. as @Brocky said, no one without white mice before his eyes would brag in public that they found a pattern in any rng🤣

 

 


@pinki

Please give us 5 potential leaks, which makes impossible for Unibet(for example)to use braekeven bots and fishprotection..

I dont want to argue, this is an honest question regarding those leaks, THX!


@pinki ?

 

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@fish8one the tension grows, grows :)

But seriously, what do you need it for? Trouble sleeping because of this? Don't you understand that it's better to assume that such things are unrealistic, especially in large joint stock companies? Especially in poker where the income from this is much less than in the case of the casino and sports betting? 

Think for a moment, I will not write anything more in this topic - because you can talk about it endlessly with your aproach 😏

"Small opportunities are often the beginning of great enterprises."
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For transparency I just want to mention I've given two members (fish8one and OliD) a two-week break from the community. There should - and is - always room for discussion, there's no limit to the number of badbeats you can share etc., but we can't go around in circles for all eternity, and these two members have hijacked the latest discussions on the frontpage for days, with posts that bring no value to anyone else (even though some members do seem to find it quite entertaining).
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Check the latest poker release notes. Have a look at our poker promotions

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@Stubbe-Unibet 

Wise decision. This thread was beginning to become a waste of my life, but like most car crashes, it's difficult to drive past without rubber-necking.

It was an interesting exercise in human psychology, I guess. What's interesting is how the "rigged" posts have evolved over the years. I've probably been reading rants like these for over fifteen years on various forums - Hendon Mob, 2+2, you name it, but back in the day when bots didn't exist, it wasn't bots that were to blame. RNGs did exist then of course, but oddly enough people didn't blame manipulation of the RNGs for their bad beats. I guess there's always something to blame.

Plus ca change, plus c'est la meme chose . . .

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Yeah, i thought i'd suggest that you create off topic section for them where they can raffle next to Trump conspiracy topic (who knows maybe they would find new friends) but banning works as well :D

I understand pissed off and posting something that want share but for days in a row, phew. Must be lot of sand between bikini and.... you know :P

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@Stubbe-Unibet wrote:

For transparency I just want to mention I've given two members (fish8one and OliD) a two-week break from the community. There should - and is - always room for discussion, there's no limit to the number of badbeats you can share etc., but we can't go around in circles for all eternity, and these two members have hijacked the latest discussions on the frontpage for days, with posts that bring no value to anyone else (even though some members do seem to find it quite entertaining).


 

Wise decision, @Stubbe-Unibet

You are right, how dare @OliD articulate his opinion on a public forum? Especially if it's not the majority opinion? This alone is a terrible thought crime in itself, but he even posted in and thus hijacked the topics he created himself. Unforgivable.

This community is built on valuable posts, how dare he write about bad beats and being "0lucky"?

Now, grown mean should be able to choose which posts to read and which posts to answer to, however due to the lack of grown men posting here, @Stubbe-Unibet knows that he has to sacrifice his time and energy and make these decisions for us. Thank you for that!

 

 

 

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We're gonna win on so many levels! We're gonna win, win, win. You're gonna get so tired of winning, you're gonna say: "Mr. President please, we don't wanna win anymore, it's too much!" And I'm gonna say: "I'm sorry, we're gonna keep winning because we're gonna make America great again!"
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Tut tut @WuDu using sarcasm, don't you know it's the lowest form of wit and I have been severely criticised for using it. Discussion is all well and good but when unbelievers refuse to accept any arguments against their pet theories and then start name calling and, in one case, accusing me of calling them stupid and ill educated when I had done no such thing, it goes beyond discussion and just turns into endless back and forth name calling, but not by me. It amuses me when conspiracy theorists, when confronted by facts and figures, or anything that doesn't support their  theory, simply accuse the bearer of being part of the conspiracy. A bit like some political threads I have read. 

"It turns out that 75% of all poker players think they play better than the other 75%."     image.png.99a4e82708d54abfc527324e8836768e.png

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@GR1ZZL3R wrote:

Tut tut @WuDu using sarcasm, don't you know it's the lowest form of wit and I have been severely criticised for using it. Discussion is all well and good but when unbelievers refuse to accept any arguments against their pet theories and then start name calling and, in one case, accusing me of calling them stupid and ill educated when I had done no such thing, it goes beyond discussion and just turns into endless back and forth name calling


 

Goodness gracious, he was such a meanie! @GR1ZZL3R, I hope you recovered quickly from this traumatic experience! If only there were a way to stop talking to people you don't want to talk to. Up until we discover and master such an advanced technology, banning heretics like @OliD is the only way to go. 

 

 

We're gonna win on so many levels! We're gonna win, win, win. You're gonna get so tired of winning, you're gonna say: "Mr. President please, we don't wanna win anymore, it's too much!" And I'm gonna say: "I'm sorry, we're gonna keep winning because we're gonna make America great again!"
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