New Loyalty System & Game Lab Release - July 1st 2021

[psrquack]

As I understood you calculate the €1 Hexapro ticket at level3 like €1 in cash rakeback reward and every bonus points like cents in cash rewards? @Andy-Unibet?

[Andy-Relax]

9 minutes ago, psrquack said:

As I understood you calculate the €1 Hexapro ticket at level3 like €1 in cash rakeback reward and every bonus points like cents in cash rewards? @Andy-Unibet?

As equivalent rakeback, yes. 

[dc10FTW]

@Andy-Unibet

Im now level 6 but i still get 150 loyalty points from a 50euro husng which is the same as i was getting when i was level 5...even tho now i have 12x multiplier instead of 6.5x(at level 5)...cand you please explain what do those 12x multiply exactly? ty.

[Andy-Relax]

The multiplier does not refer to loyalty points being multiplied, you'll always earn them at 1 loyalty point per 1c rake paid.

From level 2 onwards you earn 1% rakeback as bonus points. The multiplier refers to this value, so at level 6 you earn 12% rb as you play on top of the rewards you get when you reach the level steps.

[Purps]

8 minutes ago, creier13 said:

if i have level 5 right now,in next querter , level wiil be level 1? thank you

yes

[labadabadu]

Hi, can you please explain the bonus points multiplier reward? What does 20400 for example mean? You get that much bonus points on top of the level reward? For example I reached level 7 and got 40000 bonus points level reward, but I did not get 20400 points for sure.

 

Thanks in advance.

[bymilo]

Hi,

Why can't it just be pure cash?

- bymilo

[Stubbe-Unibet]

On 9/20/2021 at 12:36 AM, labadabadu said:

Hi, can you please explain the bonus points multiplier reward? What does 20400 for example mean? You get that much bonus points on top of the level reward? For example I reached level 7 and got 40000 bonus points level reward, but I did not get 20400 points for sure.

 

Thanks in advance.

They are paid out constantly as you rake

"As you level up, you will also unlock a Bonus Points multiplier that will reward you with additional Bonus Points as you play. From level 2 onwards, you will receive an additional 1% rakeback in Bonus Points, multiplied by your Bonus Points Multiplier, as you play through the levels

Example: To reach level 3-1 from level 3 you are required to generate 2000 loyalty points (€20 in rake). As you have unlocked the 3.5x multiplier (3.5% rakeback) for reaching level 3 you will be rewarded with a total of 70 Bonus for reaching level 3-1."

[Pickleman]

To clear up these questions and misunderstandings about how the multiplier rewards bonuses work, perhaps have a tab somewhere which keeps a history of these payouts? I know it's another tab, and that's not elegant, but if people can see how often they get these rewards and what they were, they'll be able to work it all out more easily.

Maybe it can be on the history tab like the challenges used to be? Or somewhere on the loyalty tab alongside the level rewards? I mean, I get why you haven't done this . . . by the time you get to level 7, that's literally 1000s of notifications. But there must be an elegant solution. Maybe total pay out so far, this quarter plus dates/times of the last 20 payouts? Dunno

[psrquack]

Maybe a simple solution is better. Forget the multiplier and simple say: reach levelx and we will reward your hard work with X reward (ticket/BP/bonus), what is equivalent to X% rakeback. No 2 columns, no how multiplier works etc.

[Pickleman]

3 hours ago, psrquack said:

Maybe a simple solution is better. Forget the multiplier and simple say: reach levelx and we will reward your hard work with X reward (ticket/BP/bonus), what is equivalent to X% rakeback. No 2 columns, no how multiplier works etc.

I think the problem Unibet are trying to solve is how to have a loyalty system which appeals to both high and low raking players.

Frilly, gamified bits = low raking players

$$$ = high raking players

The problem with the old system was that high rakers had to go through all the small stakes levels each quarter, with very little of value to them while they did - they wouldn't have gotten to above 25% RB until they'd raked about 9k, and probably wouldn't have bothered with all the freerolls and €1 tickets. 

The new system means they get 25%RB+ effective from the off. Unibet have solved the problem by having a second tier of bonuses which depends on your level of rake. But I absolutely agree with you - a one-stream RB system would be much more elegant. Stars solves this problem your way: have rewards based on your level, and you keep your level as long as you rake a certain amount in a certain period.

The problem is that Unibet are committed to the quarterly rake system as it ties in with their UO/UOS system. If they'd turned around and said: OK level 6 and 7 players keep their level, but everyone else has to level up each quarter (so they get the gamefied bits), it might have alienated the low stakes players and felt less inclusive?

Would be really interesting to hear the thoughts of @Stubbe-Unibet et al on this subject.

[Stubbe-Unibet]

I think the current system is really simple, but we've done a bad job at making it simple in the client. The mechanics themselves should be easy enough to understand to everyone. As mentioned earlier, we're looking into further improvements in this area (points renaming was just done, as I'm sure you've seen). The quarterly reset is not set to change and neither are any of the other key mechanics. I personally like that there's no longer a carry-over for step prizes, so that there's an incentive to really grind at the end of the quarter, but at the same time you aren't left with nothing, if you only make it halfway (still get the 16%/18% in BP)

I can also be completely transparent and say my original vision - when we first started discussing a potential new loyalty system - was very, very different to the current one. I would have loved to see a missions based setup (complete missions to earn XP) where you earn "mystery boxes" and the reward is based on a formula looking at a long list of variables (losing players getting more but there being some value in completing the missions fast). This is obviously quite similar to something existing already out there, but I think it can be done better. Just mentioning this, to make it clear that we looked into a wide range of setups before ultimately agreeing on this one - it doesn't mean I don't like the current setup, and my original idea would have been quite the gamble 🙂

Thought it might be fun to share one of my own mockups from the very early days 😄 I do think some of the wording here is better than what we have today and the idea of sub-menus I always liked, so you have a proper page explaining everything, but it was a big of challenge with the UI.

And now that we are getting nostalgic, here an unfinished mockup for my original idea (left side would be non-monetary rewards like chat items, avatars, table backgrounds and card designs. Right side would be missions as well, which grant xp to unlock a new box or spin on loyalty wheel)

[Pickleman]

OOH I like your version. But yes, you're really stuffed with the criterion that the UI needs to have similarity/compatibility across all platforms, significantly mobile gaming.

I agree with your first sentence. So we just need a simple, elegant, transparent way to present the multiplier rewards visually. How about base reward and level bonus?

[psrquack]

I like you have dropped the lootbox idea. Knowing what you will have instead of hiding behind never public algorythms is something what is more transparent for me.

 

[Pickleman]

41 minutes ago, psrquack said:

I like you have dropped the lootbox idea. Knowing what you will have instead of hiding behind never public algorythms is something what is more transparent for me.

 

+1

I know it's a bit selfish as a money making player to not like RB systems that redistribute more to losing players, and I totally get that you're doing it to sustain those players, but those RB systems are a bit scary and just make me think those sites are a bit dodgy (however wrong that thought is).

[Stubbe-Unibet]

3 hours ago, Pickleman said:

+1

I know it's a bit selfish as a money making player to not like RB systems that redistribute more to losing players, and I totally get that you're doing it to sustain those players, but those RB systems are a bit scary and just make me think those sites are a bit dodgy (however wrong that thought is).

The system I had in mind wouldn't be as extreme and we'd be transparent about the payouts in the sense that there'd be brackets; this type of spin guarantees a rakeback % of 25%-35%, as an example.

I know the mystery kind of mechanic isn't for everyone, and it doesn't have to be 🙂

[P0kerM0nk]

I also think the way the information is presented could be clearer and probably causes most of the confusion. I guess XP was called loyalty points before or am I making this up? 😆 XP is better anyway to not confuse it with Bonus Points.

First of all it would be handy to see how much xp you need till the next reward on the loyalty page. Now I don't have any idea if I'm close or far away if I wanted to know that. Although I can see it is a quarter of the xp needed from one lvl to the next one, it still would be handy to visually see the number here as well.

Also shouldn't the points multiplier be called Bonus Point Multiplier to be more clearer in the lvl description? Also like to keep Bonus Points written with both capitals and 2 words and not like in the description as 1 word and no capitals.

Then when you go to the bonus shop the Bonus Points are displayed as stars, same for every tab of different types of bonus we can buy. Could be called BP I guess? Stars are confusing to me like it is something different.

Then at the table it gives all the info needed as it should be I guess. Apart from the star next to the Bonus Points which I think is unnecessary.

Another thing which could add to some more feeling of engagement is getting some kind of notice when we earn these Bonus Points, unlike XP these Bonus Points are actually worth money so not sure if there could be a more visual way of seeing when I 'earn' them.

Edited September 24, 2021 by P0kerM0nk

[Crabtel89]

17 hours ago, Stubbe-Unibet said:

The system I had in mind wouldn't be as extreme and we'd be transparent about the payouts in the sense that there'd be brackets; this type of spin guarantees a rakeback % of 25%-35%, as an example.

I know the mystery kind of mechanic isn't for everyone, and it doesn't have to be 🙂

i mean i like the idea of giving the fun players the excitement to open boxes etc. but im not sure if these system would be incentive enough for playing more especially 25-35% RB would be quite low RB compared to other sites. i mean even pokerstars understood that they also need regular players to keep the games running and increased there Reward system up to 65%RB + everyday Promotions like Leaderboards so in the longrun 70-80% RB for grinders.

[Stubbe-Unibet]

16 hours ago, P0kerM0nk said:

I also think the way the information is presented could be clearer and probably causes most of the confusion. I guess XP was called loyalty points before or am I making this up? 😆 XP is better anyway to not confuse it with Bonus Points.

First of all it would be handy to see how much xp you need till the next reward on the loyalty page. Now I don't have any idea if I'm close or far away if I wanted to know that. Although I can see it is a quarter of the xp needed from one lvl to the next one, it still would be handy to visually see the number here as well.

Also shouldn't the points multiplier be called Bonus Point Multiplier to be more clearer in the lvl description? Also like to keep Bonus Points written with both capitals and 2 words and not like in the description as 1 word and no capitals.

Then when you go to the bonus shop the Bonus Points are displayed as stars, same for every tab of different types of bonus we can buy. Could be called BP I guess? Stars are confusing to me like it is something different.

Then at the table it gives all the info needed as it should be I guess. Apart from the star next to the Bonus Points which I think is unnecessary.

Another thing which could add to some more feeling of engagement is getting some kind of notice when we earn these Bonus Points, unlike XP these Bonus Points are actually worth money so not sure if there could be a more visual way of seeing when I 'earn' them.

Good feedback! @Andy-Unibet in charge of these improvements, and I know he has highlighted almost all of the above already. I'll follow up on it next week 🙂

[Angelo]

Hello Stubbe,

 

I;m not getting 18% bonus points starting this quarter,will i receive it later on and after a day or two will start as usual? Ty in advance

[cris1285]

Level 2 freeroll tonight - for high stake regs only? Not easy to be on L2 on day 1 of the new Q...

Not that these new loyalty freerolls are attractive, i expected more tbh than this lame attempt. I was kind of excited about the L3 one (and only for that), but around 400 peeps fighting for 30- something tix shouldnt be in a loyalty program. If you call it loyalty, reward as much player as possible. I dont even start with the speed of it (shoving fest pretty fast), because it has never changed even for the mission freerolls.

Edited October 1, 2021 by cris1285
Edit

[MadAdo]

9 minutes ago, cris1285 said:

Level 2 freeroll tonight - for high stake regs only?

I take your 'point of view', but not sure what are you talking about (to be very honest) ... I made roughly 200XP points yesterday evening just playing less than hour 3x PLO4 + 1x NL4 (should be NOT considered as high stake, me not reg either 😂) ... easy job if you play regularly or seriously or constant volume ... If you like to play just 1 table, not a problem, just need to put more time into that 🤫 Wish you all the best @cris1285 see you at the tables.

[psrquack]

24 minutes ago, MadAdo said:

I take your 'point of view', but not sure what are you talking about (to be very honest) ... I made roughly 200XP points yesterday evening just playing less than hour 3x PLO4 + 1x NL4 (should be NOT considered as high stake, me not reg either 😂) ... easy job if you play regularly or seriously or constant volume ... If you like to play just 1 table, not a problem, just need to put more time into that 🤫 Wish you all the best @cris1285 see you at the tables.

I think adding some time for players who want to reach L2 would be appreciated. For example making a double week (starting 2 freerolls on Monday and Friday of the second week of the month after the start of the next quarter) would be a good solution. Till then keeping one €50 UO ticket is the solution.

Btw: what is your opinion about the L2 freerolls? Do you think playing 4 tables for the access is well balanced or you don't bother to freerolls, just grind your way.

[cris1285]

38 minutes ago, MadAdo said:

I take your 'point of view', but not sure what are you talking about (to be very honest) ... I made roughly 200XP points yesterday evening just playing less than hour 3x PLO4 + 1x NL4 (should be NOT considered as high stake, me not reg either 😂) ... easy job if you play regularly or seriously or constant volume ... If you like to play just 1 table, not a problem, just need to put more time into that 🤫 Wish you all the best @cris1285 see you at the tables.

I admit i could have put an emoji (since the new platform, sometimes i actually cant) or "", but you got my point anyway so all good. If i dont wanna miss the "value" and wanna play it tonight, i need to play 2,5 hours 4 tabling cgs as per your calculation. No, thanks. 

I simply wanted to point out that there is an issue. Actually about an hour ago, nobody registered yet, and it says a lot. 

[MadAdo]

On 10/1/2021 at 2:46 PM, psrquack said:

Btw: what is your opinion about the L2 freerolls? Do you think playing 4 tables for the access is well balanced or you don't bother to freerolls, just grind your way.

@psrquack from my point of view the one and only one 'valuable' reward freeroll is following:

Grinding/hunting "rake" just for the chance to play any kind of freerolls seems quite useless for me 🤔 ... on the other hand, each of us should have very different view on this. Personally I take cash games just as an opportunity to take down some money if all goes expected way 🤭 (not always a case for sure). See you at the tables, have a good luck.